Tilt cutout switch advice.

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freeridenick
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Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by freeridenick »

Has anyone fitted or got any thoughts on fitting a tilt switch to cut the ignition when the bike is on its side? With a fuel pump fitted I should have one for racing.

Lots of bikes seem to have relays wired into the coils but I want something simple. I figure I can splice it into the kill switch wiring if it's just a simple tilt activated switch. I think some Suzuki's have them and R1s.
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by tony.mon »

SP's have them. But they should be universal, any switch will do.
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StuartWags
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by StuartWags »

when i was teenager i used to ride in a stunt team. We simply used a jackplug attached via a cord so the bike would stop when the rider became detached the bike stopped. probably not going to be race approved but ok for track day

I binned my CBR600 steallie in October and that got hydraulic locked
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E.Marquez
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by E.Marquez »

Every Fi street bike I can think of has one....go to a breaker and buy a salvage one for cheap or buy a new "replacement" one.

BUT...
Keep in mind there are several types I can think off off top of my head and likely more...
The type that create an open circuit when tripped are not designed for high amperage when closed, so your not going to be able to use one directly inline with say fuel pump power wire. If the FP is on a relay the tip over sensor could be used on the relay trigger wire.

The ones that send a voltage signal to the ECU (KTM for one brand) wont work for your needs.. they send a specific low voltage signal to the ECU when they are NOT triggered and no voltage when they are triggered..

The third type that comes to mind are normally closed and when triggered they short the circuit to ground like say the same as the kill switch on a dirt bike.

You will want a dead simple normally closed/open when tripped tip over switch.
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freeridenick
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by freeridenick »

E.Marquez wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 1:32 pm Every Fi street bike I can think of has one....go to a breaker and buy a salvage one for cheap or buy a new "replacement" one.

BUT...
Keep in mind there are several types I can think off off top of my head and likely more...
The type that create an open circuit when tripped are not designed for high amperage when closed, so your not going to be able to use one directly inline with say fuel pump power wire. If the FP is on a relay the tip over sensor could be used on the relay trigger wire.

The ones that send a voltage signal to the ECU (KTM for one brand) wont work for your needs.. they send a specific low voltage signal to the ECU when they are NOT triggered and no voltage when they are triggered..

The third type that comes to mind are normally closed and when triggered they short the circuit to ground like say the same as the kill switch on a dirt bike.

You will want a dead simple normally closed/open when tripped tip over switch.
Thanks for all the info. I've done a bit more reading and I think I'm wrong about needing a tilt switch, plus I keep finding posts where people have had issues with them. Not what I need on the track.

With the fuel pump fitted I need it to stop pumping fuel if the bike cuts out. So all I need is a relay but I'm not sure where to take the power from. Coil wire? From what I understand of the wiring diagrams I've seen simple ones have a ground terminal, a power feed and power out to the fuel pump. Something like that anyway.

An alternative would be a mechanical pump.
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E.Marquez
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by E.Marquez »

freeridenick wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 10:16 pm With the fuel pump fitted I need it to stop pumping fuel if the bike cuts out. So all I need is a relay
Well no I think you would need a logic circuit and a relay.

I cant think of any item, controller, ect that is "powered" only if the motor is running, that could be used directly as a relay trigger signal

The logic circuit would detect or not say a ignition coil pulse (motor running) if it detects that signal, then trigger signal sent to the relay to power the pump.
An aftermarket digital, programmable PDM is what I would do, and use it for all the bikes power needs
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popkat
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by popkat »

E.Marquez wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:37 pm
freeridenick wrote: Mon Feb 03, 2020 10:16 pm With the fuel pump fitted I need it to stop pumping fuel if the bike cuts out. So all I need is a relay
Well no I think you would need a logic circuit and a relay.

I cant think of any item, controller, ect that is "powered" only if the motor is running, that could be used directly as a relay trigger signal

The logic circuit would detect or not say a ignition coil pulse (motor running) if it detects that signal, then trigger signal sent to the relay to power the pump.
An aftermarket digital, programmable PDM is what I would do, and use it for all the bikes power needs

Or the fuel cut relay from the bike the pump come off. CBR600 I think, then work out how to wire it in, I'll try and remember to check my VFR manual tomorrow to see how it wires in (same relay as CBR) unless you've already checked Nick ?



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freeridenick
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by freeridenick »

popkat wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:49 pm Or the fuel cut relay from the bike the pump come off. CBR600 I think, then work out how to wire it in, I'll try and remember to check my VFR manual tomorrow to see how it wires in (same relay as CBR) unless you've already checked Nick
Not yet. I have looked at relay wiring and they look to have four pins, one for power in, one for power out and a ground. In the diagrams I've seen the fourth pin isn't used. I've got a CBR600 wiring diagram somewhere.
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E.Marquez
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by E.Marquez »

popkat wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:49 pm
Or the fuel cut relay from the bike the pump come off. CBR600 I think, then work out how to wire it in, I'll try and remember to check my VFR manual tomorrow to see how it wires in (same relay as CBR) unless you've already checked Nick ?

Looking at a CBR600F4i diagram, Image

I think the fuel cut off relay is triggered by the ECU, and the ECU gets a tip over signal from the tip over sensor.

So the fuel cut off relay itself is not going to work, its just a dumb standard relay. It still needs a trigger signal to unlatch ..and on the CBR anyway that comes from the ECU by way of the TP sensor.
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Re: Tilt cutout switch advice.

Post by popkat »

E.Marquez wrote: Sun Feb 09, 2020 1:58 pm
popkat wrote: Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:49 pm
Or the fuel cut relay from the bike the pump come off. CBR600 I think, then work out how to wire it in, I'll try and remember to check my VFR manual tomorrow to see how it wires in (same relay as CBR) unless you've already checked Nick ?

Looking at a CBR600F4i diagram, Image

I think the fuel cut off relay is triggered by the ECU, and the ECU gets a tip over signal from the tip over sensor.

So the fuel cut off relay itself is not going to work, its just a dumb standard relay. It still needs a trigger signal to unlatch ..and on the CBR anyway that comes from the ECU by way of the TP sensor.

On the F2 AND F3 CBR and also the early VFR it's a fuel cut relay that takes it's signal from a coil, it then regulates the voltage to the pump depending on rev input. It's quite clever and why they aren't cheap from Honda..
For years I thought it was more simple but after removing mine and then having issues with float bowl flooding after hard braking I've refitted it and hoping it's cured the problem.



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2014 CRMC Post classic Superbike champion.
2014 CRMC Post classic senior production champion. On a Suzuki Katana 1100
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