starter problem!!!!

[jambo]

hi all,have a right prob with my storm,she wont start with the button but will on a push(hard work)
so heres whats happening,starter motor is spinning but engine is'nt turning,so replaced sprag clutch,starter driven gear and needle bearings(2nd hand parts)
trouble is after doing this it's still the same
have done searches on the site and was wondering where the starting sensor is and would it make the bike do what it's doing??
also when all put together i looked in the hole that the startor motor goes into and the idle gear will move clock wise but not anti-clockwise(as said in haynes manual) does this point to the sprag clutch i replaced also being faulty??????
also if faulty side stand switch,would the engine still try to turn or just the startor motor(clutching at straws there i think)
anyone got any ideas before i go an buy a brand shiny new sprag clutch??
thanks in advance
jambo

[tony.mon]

Hard one to diagnose without seeing the bike, but one thing- the sidestand cutout would just cut power to the starter relay, so it's not that.
Anyway, to test this you just link the two wires together, so it's easy to rule out.

It could just be that the motor hasn't enough current to engage, so try putting jump leads on form a car or another bike and trying it then.

If it starts, it's your battery, and possibly (worth checking if the battery's not holding charge) the reg/rec.

I'd check these first before replacing anything else.

[sirch345]

Trying a set of jump leads as Tony suggest is a good idea IMHO too, you only need to attach the positive lead (+) just while you're pressing the starter button. It could well be that the starter motor is not getting enough power to it for it to engage properly. If using a set of jump leads from another vehicle to the Firestorms battery connections doesn't make any difference try connecting the live lead direct to the starter motor. If that still makes no difference what about the condition of the bolt (where the main lead connects) on the starter motor also what about the condition of the starter motor brushes

Chris.

[jambo]

will try her from the cage,have tried a starter motor off a running storm and still nothing
thanks
jambo

[sirch345]

will try her from the cage,have tried a starter motor off a running storm and still nothing
thanks
jambo

By trying another starter motor from a running Storm will rule out my thoughts on brushes.

In that case I would try the live postive (+) jump lead direct to the starter motor bolt, see if that makes any difference. Make sure it's not in gear when you try that.

Chris.

[jambo]

will try her from the cage,have tried a starter motor off a running storm and still nothing
thanks
jambo

By trying another starter motor from a running Storm will rule out my thoughts on brushes.

In that case I would try the live postive (+) jump lead direct to the starter motor bolt, see if that makes any difference. Make sure it's not in gear when you try that.

Chris.

no joy,just spinning merrily away singing its own tune

[jambo]

Jambo,

The starter relay switch is under the tail piece plastics on the left hand side of the bike.

Another guy on here had a similar prob a while back and was the lead to the starter, was all corroded and wasnt getting the current through cos of resistance due to corrosion.

If the starter is spinning, the button etc is ok but may not be getting enough through to engage fully (as Tony said).

I have all the bits you could need except for the starter motor itself, i am more than happy to send them through to you on a sale or return basis so you can test stuff out. Let me know asap please mate as i am sticking them on Ebay probably tonight.

read on here about a starter sensor,presuming that is just another name for the relay??
everything seems to be working fine,so it looks loike it'l have to be a brand new sprag clutch

[jambo]

tryed the starter trick with a booster no joy,i find it hard to believe that the second hand sprag clutch i put in is also knackered?????? any thoughts on that?
priced new parts and dinny really want to be going buying them until im positive that i need those parts
so anyone any ideas throw em out there......please

[goody]

I'd check it was all assembled correctly. I'm currently having sprag issues on my pegaso and from wht i've read knackered sprags make a right old racket, mine is! or they fall apart which would be pretty obvious if you've just put yours in. Is it possible to put it in the wrong way round?
I'm not sure but aren't bike starters always 'engaged' hence the need for a sprag clutch?

[jambo]

I'd check it was all assembled correctly. I'm currently having sprag issues on my pegaso and from wht i've read knackered sprags make a right old racket, mine is! or they fall apart which would be pretty obvious if you've just put yours in. Is it possible to put it in the wrong way round?
I'm not sure but aren't bike starters always 'engaged' hence the need for a sprag clutch?

took her apart 3 times and rebuilt still the same
thats the weird thing there is no weird noise comeing from the sprag

[tony.mon]

You haven't stripped the splines on the starter motor output shaft, have you?
I'm clutching (no pun intended) at straws now, there's nothing obvious left to try....

So back to basics.
Try removing the LH alternator cover, so that you can see the sprag clutch behind the alt rotor. Operate the starter, and see if the sprag clutch gear is rotating.
If it is, then your sprag is not operating properly.
If it isn't, then the problem lies on the reduction gears.

Might be worth pulling the alternator off and checking that the teeth on the idle/reduction gear are ok.
While you're there, make sure that the sprag clutch will turn freely one way (anti clock, I think) but not the other, while it's in position on the back of the alternator rotor.

Good luck!

[jambo]

well thanks for all the help been a big help,latest is that i pulled it all apart AGAIN cant find anything wrong
the only bit of wear i can see is on the sprag very very slight but its the only thing it can be(me hopes)so ordered bran new shiny part from honda,gonn be waiting till next friday for it to arrive and the weather to be loverly and the devils disciples rally is on this weekend and i canny go now

[goody]

Did you do what tony suggested? sounds like it would identify the problem.

[jambo]

Did you do what tony suggested? sounds like it would identify the problem.

yea did what he said so basicly points to sprag clutch,when you look in from the starter motor the gear will turn freelly clockwise so that's that,all gears were in good nick just the small bit of wear on the bearings of the sprag

[jambo]

well im on the road,wwwwwhhhhhhhhhooooooooooooooo
wasted a 100euro on a new sprag clutch(not the problem)it turned out to be the idle/reduction gear
it looks like a complete unit,but it's not held together with a cerclip(spelling) anyway took it out and you could turn the two parts independitly so i welded it together and bang first tap of the button she started,have since given her a full service and im enjoying the ride
thank's to all for the help mucho grasias
jambo