problem

[sepia]

soz havnt been on as my pc nae working,im on my girlfriends @ mo.

went to girlfriends m8s today.

turned off bike for 5 mins & when went to start again the dash lights came on for 2 seconds & then nothing.no light s on dash,no starter noise no power whatsoever.

got a jump start & it started after 2mins.i then switched lights on & it died.got jump start again & drove it home without lights on.

on the drive home the dash lights were working when bike was running but everytime i put on the brakes the millage gauge went off & the rev counter didnt work.stopped @ garage & left bike running & girlfriend said while ticking over all the above was flickering on & off.

got bike home & turn on ignition & nothing.

lose wire? r&r knacked & knacked battery? put on 2nd hand finned r&r last month.

also the jump leads were getting hot when using to start bike.

any help welcome.

thanks steve.

[sepia]

hi.

just went out to look @ bike 2 turn it on & noticed was a very faint oil/stand light.then i put on kill switch & the lights got brighter but still no power for starter.

so is it just a knacked battery?.it has been starting 1st time all day.can the r&r knacker with just turnning ignition on without bike starting?.

hope gave enough info to solve problem.

thanks steve.

[sepia]

ps.

can anyone help me by monday morning as have to get home to aberdeen from dundee.

im thinking r&r knaked & has knacked battery thats why jump leads were getting hot when on my battery.

so thinking have to drive home & change r&r for orig 1 & put in spare battery.

could be wrong,but cant think of anything else & after being on this site & picking up the knowhow i think this is what has happend ?????,lol.

sorry forgot to say.had bike sitting for 5 days & when went to start bike wasnt a lot of battery power & got 3 shots @ tryin to start & it wouldnt(had been raining over night with a light frost in the morning).got jump start & fired up fine.went for spin to charge up battery & next day it started ok(this happend wed/thur).could this still be to do with water problem i had in switch housing.when i got bike started from jump today & it died when switched on lights could there still be water in switch housing.has the r&r got anything to do with putting right power to lights etc.

the weather has been sunny in aberdeen for last 3 weeks with just 2days of rain.with bike been running fine last few weeks & weather been good if any water left in wiring ,if any surley it would of dried off by now.

since got jump start thur bike has been starting 1st time.so whats the only thing that can drain a full battery power from switching off & then switching back on 5mins later.

sorry for ranting off but had a few drinks & just peed off that driving down to dundee today in nice hot weather & the 1st time to enjoy the bike in great biking weather & after all the problems ive had it all goes wrong again.

thanks steve.

[sepia]

just remembered.

if r&r is knackerd,even when jump start will i be able to drive 65miles home.wont the battery start overheating?.can r&r be disconected after getting started or is that a stupid question.

anyone in dundee have a spare r&r & battery to lend for a week,lol.

cheers steve.

[benny hedges]

you might get away with disconnected the r/r, make sure your battery has a full charge and make sure you ride in daylight hours.
using the lights will flatten the battery in no time if you're not charging.

if the battery is fkt you might be able to get one from a car accessory place, locally.
i have a spare r/r & batt, but im like 250 miles away from you lol

you can get a new r/r for £20 off ebay - honda finned type or yam style, your choice.

the bike will start off a jump but only while there is power to run the ignition.
a fully charged battery will get you 65 miles easy.
might be worth disconnecting the starter lead once it's running just in case you're losing juice there, and also if you stall it you will be tempted to just push the start button, then you're going nowhere lol

it's worth making up some small jump leads & keeping them under the seat, just for emergencies like this.

[sepia]

thanks benny h,so many options lol.

can the r&r get knacked by just switching the ignition on,dosnt it have to be running.

i do have the orig r&r @ home,its still good cause i swapped it over with a finned 1 thinking it was my problems from before,but it wasnt.also have spare battery @ home.alas there 70miles away.

battery was good to start bike to get me to place it broke down.just amazed that switching off ignition then battery goes flat as soon as switched back on.

going to try neighbours for a battery charger,got a feeling its knacked & if does charge think will just go flat as soon as switch on ignition.
e0A
it took a few times to get it to start from jump leads.is this cause battery had to get enough power charged up for it to run.

with lights going on & bike died & dash not working when using breaks does that mean was only enough battery power to do one thing @ a time.

bike seemed ok to drive the 2miles home from the jump start with lights off & dash went off when hitting the breaks.maybe once started there is just enough to drive the bike,thats if it is r&r.cant see anything else that would cause this.

thanks.

[Jazzscot]

I had something similar happen to me the other week. I also fitted a new R+R but did not fit a new battery. Can anybody tell me what the voltages on the battery should be??? (both at rest and when revs are applied) I just want to know that my new R+R is charging ok but I have my suspitions that I need a new battery. If I need a new battery where would be the best place to get it from, Im sure there was a thread on this before.


Cheers Jazz

[sepia]

GOT CHARGER BUT LOOKS LIKE BATTERY IS DEAD.

BATTERY WOULD OF BEEN IN THE SAME STATE YESTERDAY BUT IT DID START OFF THE JUMP LEADS & WAS ABLE TO DRIVE.

IF I GIVE HER A JUMP TOMORROW & STARTS LIKE YESTERDAY WHATS MY CHANCES OF MAKING IT HOME @ 70MILES.

PS JUST PUT IN BATTERY AFTER 2HOURS CHARGING TO SEE IF WORKING,ALL I GOT WAS A FAINT OIL,STAND & NEUTRAL LIGHT.THIS WAS A BIT MORE THAN HAD YESTERDAY & JUMP STARTED THEN.SO WILL IT BE ENOUGH TO DRIVE WITH JUMP START TOMORROW?.

THANKS STEVE.

[sepia]

hi guys & dolls.

went to jump start bike but no go.was only willing to try & start a wee bit & was smoke coming from the jump leads.lights on dash were strong from jumping.
was the leads getting hot cause goosed battery or cause r&r goosed.guy helping me jump start said it must be more than the battery thats causing tthe leads to go that hot.can the battery just go flat from a full charge in the space of 5mins or has it got to be the r&r that causes this.just worried incase something else caused the battery to go flat.i didnt think the r&r could flatten a battery by just switching on ignition & engine not running or am i wrong.is it just possible the battery just died.

battery is totaly goosed.will have to try & get a new 1.

whats the best thing to do when get new battery.will i disconect the r&r 1st incase i goose the new battery(could the new battery get goosed if i put in new battery & switch on ignitiong with goosed r&r) & just try to get home with new battery on its own.

also both my bolts are just turnning on my back fairing(the 2 near the battery box).will i still be able to get to r&r by undoing the four other scews.

thanks steve.

[sepia]

just spoke to bike shop guy & he dosnt think the r&r would flatten a battery just by switching on ignition,yes if bike was running & over charging etc.

could it just be that the battery was on its last legs?.

with all the problems i have been having ive been using & charging both my batterys a hell of a lot over last 3months.

thanks steve.

[tony.mon]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, bad this doesn't sound like just a knackered battery, unless the battery has an internal short.

If the jump leads are getting hot then I'd say that you are trying to put a lot of current through the leads, which even with a flat battery won't be enough to get them hot.
So I'd guess that you have a short somewhere, maybe reg/rec/maybe alternator windings or lead, but could be anywhere.

This is a difficult one to diagnose without seeing the bike, which might be why you haven't had a lot of replies.

Trouble is, if you put a brand new battery on you could easily kill it if there's a fault elsewhere, reg/rec for instance.
And you can blow a reg/rec of there's a short elsewhere, too, so trying to replace one item at a time isn't necessarily going to help.

Some good news- the captive nuts in the subframe spinning around is not unknown- my bike does this too- and as long as you aren't trying to remove the tail plastic for spraying (for instance) you can stretch it over the other four fixings and just pivot it high enough to get to the reg/rec- I did this successfully.

Sooner or later I'll have to find a way to hold them still so i can undo the bolts, but suspect I'll have to break the plastic out of the way in order to get to them.
If I find a non-destructive solution I'll post it up.

But back to your electrical problem- I'm thinking that if it was me I'd bite the bullet and get an bike-competent auto electrician out with a spare battery and reg/rec on hand, as the electrician will (no pun intended) charge you more for these than you can buy them yourself.
If by any chance you don't need to use them, then someone on here will have them off you, or you can put them back on E-Blag.

As I said, sorry this isn't the solution you were hoping for, and it's just my input- hopefully someone else will have a better idea.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes.....

[sepia]

thanks tony.

havnt tried the fairng yet but was hoping id be able to do what you said.

would be great if it was just the r&(have spare & batt @ home)r.when the battery was goosed how did bike mange to just start & was able to drive it.it did take a while to start even with bike being hot.would i of just been getting enough out of the battery to power the ignition.i am hoping that if to much charging was getting to battery etc that thats the r&r thats putting out wrong charge as thats its job?.

remember i was having trouble with no sparking & then a whole week with battery going flat everyday & found out it was water in the switch housing/wiring loom.maybe with me driving about 3 months with all that wtaer in electrics i might of done damage to the r&r.might still be a bit of water somewhere causing a bit of trouble.

im away to pick up new battery soon.the kind garage people are charging it as we speak & havnt paid for it yet.my kind of people.will disconect r&r then put new battery in the morning & @ least get the bike home.i will pick up spare r&r & batt & take to work & swap r&r.the r&r thats in is the finned newer honda 1 but it was 2nd hand so maybe was on way out.

i must admit im not 100% that it is the r&r.im afraid i couldnt afford mechanic @ the mo,buying new battery was last on my list.

will keep informed,but pc @ home playing up will see what happens.

thanks again.

[tony.mon]

Fair enough, all you can do is start at the charging circuit and see what outputs you have all the way through, connecting things up one at a time.
So:
Disconnect reg/reg, turn off all lights, connect battery, turn on ignition and see if there's a current drain on the battery.
if you watch the voltage dropping with a meter across the terminals set to voltage (up to 20 will do) then something's eating your current, best find out what. Do this by unplugging things until it stop, then chase the connectors out until you isolate the fault.

If there's no appreciable current drop then try to start the engine.
Assuming that's ok, move on to the reg/rec:

At the reg/rec output connector under the tail plastics, RH side, find which three wires come from the alternator windings. Connect the voltmeter (set to up to at least 100 volts), red to each output lead in turn, black to ground, frame or batt neg.
These three should output a voltage between about ??14 and ??40 volts, increasing as you rev the engine. (I am not sure exactly what voltages you get, but anywhere like this is fine).

Now find the lead that goes form the reg/rec connector to the battery, this is the output from the alternator once it's been rectified and regulated, so shouldn't be more than 14.5-15 volts, really.
Disconnect it from the battery end, because you don't want to be shooting excess voltage up a new battery, and put the red meter lead (range up to 20 volts) on the r/r output and the black one on the frame or batt negative.
With the alternator connected to the reg/rec you should now get a voltage that varies between 13 and 15 volts-ish. A volt or two either way is fine.

If this all checks out then you have a short elsewhere, can't be more specific than that.
But from what you've said the battery is draining quickly enough that it doesn't seem to be a normal flat/tired battery, short across alternator windings or reg/rec feels more likely.



I'm no electrician, and if someone on here has more detailed advice, please chip in.

[sepia]

thanks tony.

away for battery now.i dont have a volt meter here to test anything.

cheers

[sepia]

went to pick up battery.

when told mechanic about all the water i had in light switch housing he couldnt see how that could of stopped me having my no sparking & battery not charging.he thot maybe on the kill switch side.but when i got rid of the water & sprayed & cleaned it the bike fired up straight away.he didnt think r&r would kill battery the way it did & thought more a bad connection somewhere.

said i shouldnt of jump started from a car but what other way is there.

when i put in new battery,to save the power would i be better getting a jump start to start bike incase i drain to much power trying to start her.

only thing im worried about is that i put in new battery with r&r disconected & if its something else it kills battery as soon as i switch ignition on.
when i put in goosed battery this morning i got a very faint dash lights but no millage.when put on kill switch the lights got brighter so does that mean the kill switch is live until you use to kill engine.

might put battery in later & see what happens with ignition on & r&r disconected.i bought the cheapest bike battery charger(all i could afford) so can charge if need to.got volt meter now.