Help CCT Falure????????? Advice needed

[Jazzscot]

Your thoughts, advice and reassurances are sought by a worried fellow forum member.
This morning while commuting to work I has just overtaken an Audi TT and had to silp in behind a lorry before a blind corner. As I rolled off the throttle a noise started coming from below me.

At first it sounded like the noise my old push bike used to make when I put a piece of card in the back spokes and pretended I was on a motorbike. My first reaction was that the chain had loosened off and was rattling against my link pipe, However when I pulled the clutch in the nose dropped with the revs.

I managed to glide to a stop and turned off the engine. The drive chain was still tight and not hitting the link pipe.

So I’m stuck in the middle of nowhere and I’m now thinking CCT FALURE. Noise seems to be coming from the front end.

Ok I was feeling lucky and I started the engine again and its still rattling away.

I decided that I would try and ride the 15 miles home. I kept the revs constant and tried not to go too fast. Sound defo sounds like a chain rattling about a bit. So after crapping myself that it would jump a tooth I managed to get home with it all in one piece and think I have been a very lucky boy.

I have a set of manual cct’s coming from Rider on a Storm.

My question is……. Has anybody ridden the bike after cct failure and what does the bike sound like??? and if the front one has let go is the procedure for installing new ones any different from the cct replacement guide in the workshop knowledgebase?


Any tips or thoughts greatly received.


Jazz

[Stratman]

Mine went when I was riding and continued for about 10 miles (didn't know what it was then). Stopped for petrol (had to) and then wouldn't restart as had then jumped a tooth or so.

I would say do not ride until properly fixed otherwise bent valves will be the result

[Rider on a Storm]

sh1t jazz ur unlucky mate, hopefully it aint done any harm but it dont sound good. CCT's should be with you tomorrow and if ur lucky that will be all you need. Going to post some details on other forum that will I have 20 sets done by 4th june just have to drill and pin them, just fu**in bullin that I hadnt ccts for you a week earlier

[Jazzscot]

Na its cool Tray sh1t happens. I prob wouldnt have fitted them till I was off on holiday in July anyway so dont feel bad. I am fairly sure that there aint been any damage done as I managed to ride home ok (even if it was a wee bit noisy) Thanks again for your thoughts.

Jazz

[Rider on a Storm]

Na its cool Tray sh1t happens. I prob wouldnt have fitted them till I was off on holiday in July anyway so dont feel bad. I am fairly sure that there aint been any damage done as I managed to ride home ok (even if it was a wee bit noisy) Thanks again for your thoughts.

Jazz

Let us no how fitting the ccts goes ok, if they arrive tomorrow you will probaly want to get them in straight away. If fitting them urself the procedure we seen here by sirch will be a big help

[Mick B]

Thats bad luck Jazz

I hope you get it sorted quickly and the damage if any is to the minimal .Another reason to put manuals in .Since I sorted mine and set them up my days out are a lot better and no more worrying.

[Jazzscot]

Where are all the CCT experts to offer me advice?????

[marlbororman]

i just changed mine via sirch`s guide in the workshop section, it is a doddle. just follow to the letter step by step, you cant go wrong

[Jazzscot]

I was wondering as I think the front one has gone can I just put a manual one straight in or do I have to turn the engine to the marks before I do it??

[tony.mon]

No, you definitely need to have the engine in the correct place before you remove the broken one.

And for peace of mind it's definitely worth taking off the front and rear cylinder cam covers and checking the cam timing, carefully following the thread in the Workshop Knowledgebase.

It will still run if you've bent some valves; if you haven't got a compression tester to check it then you can get an idea from the valve clearances.
Usually if the valves are bent, even slightly, they don't seat properly and that will increase the valve clearances by quite a bit, enough to put them outside the range of acceptable clearances.

If that's happened, don't run the engine, pull off the affected head and replace the valves.

The usual culprits are the front cylinder exhaust pair.
You also need a head gasket and (unless you're really lucky) new shims for at least that head.
(might as well re-shim back to spec while it's apart).

But fingers crossed....

[Jazzscot]

Ok, just having a cuppa after removing the rear CCT and fitted the new manual one. Tony mate the front valves seem to be fine mate as they are within the range of acceptable clearance. My question is...... what is the best way to set up the front manual cct tension.
I also read that once its in and screwed up a bit then you can use the starter moter to turn the engine over and gauge tension by sount and feel.

Your thoughts please gents.


Jazz

[benny hedges]

er, suggest you turn it over by hand bud, take the plugs out and spin it over a few times.
follow the guide to the letter and don't be in a rush to fire it up!
to ease your mind take off both cam covers and double check it's timed up proper, then happy riding

[tony.mon]

Unfortunately the best way to set tension is to have measured how far the old one sticks into the cylinder, then set the manual to a bit less than that for an initial setting.
Then you can "tune" it by ear, if it's too loose it'll rattle, if too tight it'll slow the tickover slightly, and if much too tight you'll get a squeal.

But now you've removed it, you're left with taking off the cam cover, then feeling for tension on the top chain run between the cams.

[Unitedwestand]

Hi my cct's started to rattle on the way to work one saturday morning i was a bit nieve with the failings of firestorm cct's and heard the rattling but continued on my journey to work which was approximately 7 miles from the time that the rattle started.
I rode in a more conservative style got to work and phoned my mechanic who informed me that it was more than likely the ccts and not to ride or start the bike.
So i used the AA and got the bike delivered home.
I bought a second hand cct off Ebay and stripped the bike down using a Haynes manual replaced the front cct(why is that the one that always seems fail) the most difficult to get to
I changed the front cct and checked the timing by removing the front and rear cam covers. Everything was as it should be with regards to the timing and valve clearences so put it all back together and test rode the bike and everything seemed fine.
I bought some new ccts from david silver and replaced them both using the instructions found on this site and the bike passed its mot and is back on the road after being off the road for a year iv been using the storm for a month now and too be honest its as good as new and keeps making me smile especially when i accelerate with the Remus cans iv now got fitted
So i guess i was lucky(my bike had only done 13000 miles which may have had something to do with the luck) but if you do ride on and the gods are with you...you can avoid too much damage but
riding on is not adviseable if you know what the rattle is
I hope the gods are with you on this one Jazzscot
Regards Chris

[tony.mon]

Interesting point re mileage; I hadn't considered this before but it's likely that the age of the cam chain (i.e. how stretched it is) has a bearing (no pun intended) on how likely the chain is to jump teeth on the cam sprockets.

If the chain only jumps one tooth (or none, obviously) there's no damage, and you can just replace the CCT's and re-time.
But if it jumps two or more teeth, then piston meets valve with interesting consequences.

Personally I've counted myself lucky with only having to replace two pairs of exhaust valves, one front and one rear, on the the two occasions mine went before I saw the light and fitted manuals.
The nightmare scenario, of course, is if the valve head separates from the stem, and drops into the cylinder.
Then you're going to have to fit a new piston, head, and big ends at least.

If you're really unlucky it'll also take out the crank, even rods and cases.


If this has happened to you, we might have to extend the Workshop Day by a couple of hours!