Clutch Cover removal

[bbb]

Hello All,
Need to replace the friction plates in a freinds firestorm, ordered the plates and clutch cover gasket but have just noticed that the water pump is bolted to the clutch cover. Does the water pump need to be removed seperately or can it come off as part of the cover?

Do we need to order a water pump gasket as well?

Many Thanks
bbb

[tony.mon]

Hi.
The water pump needs to be removed.
You have to drain the coolant, and undo the pipes from the pump, then you can remove it.
The clutch cover will remain connected by the ignition trigger lead; you could disconnect this from the connector on the LH side of the engine, but often the lead is rapped under the coolant reservoir, and isn't easy to remove.
But by supporting the clutch cover on an upturned bucket or similar you can work on the clutch with it still connected.

Make sure you check the clutch spring length, as the springs shorten over time, allowing the plates to slip a little, and clean the pushrod (it pulls out
from the clutch centre) while your'e there, as this also affects clutch operation sometimes, due to grease from the chain clogging it up in the clutch slave cylinder housing/sprocket cover.

Lastly if you've used fully synth oil, that can also cause slip on occasion.

Semi synth seems to cure it most times.

[bbb]

we will need a waterpump gasket as well? anything else needed?
Have got - plates, oil, filter, clutch cover gasket.

many thanks
bbb

[tony.mon]

No, you can re-use the water pump o-ring, a slight smear of silicon gasket seals it ok, mind out you don't seal up the channel leading to the overflow hole or 90 bend pipe if one fitted.

[bbb]

thanks...
Haynes isn't too clear, so...
1. drain oil and coolant and disconnect the hoses.
2. Undo three water pump cover bolts and remove the cover - does the impellor just pull out?
3. Undo the clutch cover and move to one side (remember cable)
4. check / replace clutch plates and springs
5. clutch cover back on
6. push pump impellor back on - any oil seals?
7. pump cover back on with silicon sealant on the o ring
8. replace oil and coolant.

Struggling to visualise the water pump aspect, not replaced a clutch where the pump has been integral to the cover, hopefully it will be obvious once i get started. Just want to make sure I have all the parts as I will doing the work outside and want to get it finished in one hit.

edit...
does the pump cover only need to come off because the bolts hold it onto the crank case through the clutch cover?
the impellor bearings and seals come off as part of the clutch cover.

Thanks again
bbb

[tony.mon]

Nearly.
There's four bolts (not three) holding the water pump on, and yes, I believe that two go through into the crankcases.

And although this will sound odd, remove the clutch lever from its housing on the bars before you start, otherwise the slave cylinder can push far enough out to allow air into the hydraulic clutch and it'll need bleeding.

You won't need to disturb the impellor; it stays in the clutch cover.

And if you don't replace the hoses before you put the coolant back in it will fall out again!

You don't need to drain the oil, just lean the bike onto the sidestand and the oil stays below the lower clutch cover level.
If it won't lean over far enough, a small block under the front tyre will help, some sidestands seem to allow more lean angle than others.

But it might be a good idea to replace with fresh oil and filter while you've got the tools out, depending on when it was last done.
Be careful with any coolant drips falling into the open engine, and contaminating the oil.

It's an easy job; you'll see what needs to be done when you get started, and there's nothing tricky, hidden, or needing a special technique.

[benny hedges]

i take mine off by leaning the bike against a wall on the left then it doesnt lose any oil.

but if you are going to remove the clutch pushrod imo its best to drop the oil and remove the pushrod from the slave cylinder side to avoid dragging crap through the seal and possibly damaging it.
(take the clutch lever off before removing the sprocket cover with the slave so the piston doesnt creep out or lose fluid)

[bbb]

just putting the pressure plate back on but so far have snapped two of the bolts, both sheared just below the head.
no where near the torque in the haynes of 12Nm. the bolts screw in very easily but then seem to bottom out then snap.
I have replaced them with two decent quality socket caps and the original washer. Is it ok to tighten them until they bottom out and nip them up or do we need to replace all five bolts?

[tony.mon]

Length will be critical, measured from under the washer to the top on the mounting post.

I've not had or heard of one of these shearing before, but then I don't use a torque wrench on smaller bolts; I prefer to work to feel rather than a torque setting.

I'd use a complete set of the same bolts.

I have a set of secondhand originals if you need them.

[benny hedges]

er... they shouldnt be snapping m8...
use thread locking compound, tighten them evenly and nice & square, then just a nip.
theyre only farty little bolts so dont go mad!

[bbb]

just did them up till they gently bottomed then gave them a nip lever action feels fine and the pressure plate pushes back ok. wasn't sure if they had to be torqued spot-on to prevent the clutch either grabbing or slipping if too tight / lose. put a spot of red grease on the socket caps then fitted the clutch cover, no transfer of grease to the cover so i'm guessing clearence is ok, they stick out around 1 - 1.5mm more than the originals - will this be an issue?

refitted the gasket and cover but have only lightly tightened the bolts just in case i have to go back in.

the original plates looked ok but were at their service limit as were the old springs but of more concern was the fact that the anti-judder spring and spring seat were fitted after the first friction plate

thanks
bbb

[benny hedges]

more concern was the fact that the anti-judder spring and spring seat were fitted after the first friction plate

have you had issues with the clutch grabbing - usually when attempting a fast take-off, it'll make a NERRR noise then attempt to buck you off the back.

im sure this is an issue with the anti-judder spring or seat and it's position & condition

a few of us have had this problem but there hasnt been a positive answer as to what causes it.
i think it's dodgy reassembly.

[AMCQ46]

As Tony said. Use a full set of the same bolts, or put your new bolts 180 deg opposite each other. Clutch must be balanced or you will get vibration

[bbb]

does anybody know the torque settings for the clutch cover and water pump housing bolts?
Haynes is particularly unenlightening could be anywhere between 10Nm and 42 Nm depending on the wording. Have looked on-line but can't find a cutaway engine image just want to ensure that the slightly larger bolt heads on the clutch springs won't be an issue.

thanks
bbb

[benny hedges]

you'll only need to nip them m8, theyre only m6 going into ally so dont go mad.
nice & easy does it!
1/4" drive is ideal as you cant really overtighten with it - dont go using a 1/2" strong bar!