Brake caliper service question.

[sirch345]

I'm very happy to say the problem is now resolved

Update
I opened one of the bleed nipples today, the brakes stayed the same, still binding,

So definitly no pressure in the hydrolics then

Pete.l

Exactly.

So with that result I decided to pull one of the calipers apart again. Once the caliper was apart I couldn't really see I'd done anything wrong, all the seals were seated in their grooves properly. I could not detect any angle at the bottom of the main seal groove (I don't have anything suitable to measure that accurately, so that was only by eye), or could I see any angle on the seals. The only thing I could see was what looked like a deeper groove on one side of the bottom groove for the main seal. In the end I had to go with my intuition, and one main seal did seem to me it could be in back-to-front so I swapped it around. I next put it all back together and refitted it to the bike, plus bled the system. With just that caliper fitted I could get three and half revolutions from a hard spin of the wheel by hand, wow that surprised me, a result. Thinking this could have been a fluke I had to do the same procedure on the 2nd caliper just to prove to myself it wasn't. A result with that one as well. With both front calipers re-fitted I can now get two full revolutions of the front wheel with a hard spin by hand, much better than the three quarters of one full turn that I was only able to get.

I got thinking about this problem, as having worked on a fair few brake systems over the years on a variety of different vehicles, but never experienced this problem before from just a caliper service. It suddenly dawned on me, I had never (that I can remember anyway) re-used old seals before. With that thought in mind I ordered up a full new set from David Silvers including the joining seals for the two caliper halves.
I also picked up two new bleed nipples and new cooper crush washers locally today.

Now all I have to do is pull the calipers apart again and fit all the new parts, although I'm getting quite good at pulling them apart now

I coat the main (inner) piston seal with DOT 4 brake fluid and the dust (outer) seal with PBR rubber grease. I believe some people use silicon grease. I then insert the pistons with a twisting motion after coating the piston with brake fluid. It works for me.

That is the same way as I have been doing that and I use red rubber grease (RRG) not silicone grease. It looks like the dust seals on the Storm have a groove in them on the inside around the full circumference, so I presume they are there to hold a small amount of grease.

I ordered the seals from David Silver yesterday at 1-30pm, to my amazement they arrived here today just after 1pm, excellent service or what They used FedExuk couriers.

Many thanks to all who contributed to this issue

Chris.

[Cadbury64]

Thanks for explaining the resolution here Chris. Congratulations on solving the puzzle.


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[thunderbolt]

Chris, glad you got it sorted. Like you (except this time) I always use new seals since they don't cost that much and the calipers are off and apart anyway.

I also ordered new rear sintered OEM brake pads and I had them delivered to my front door in 6 days. That's pretty good from UK to Sydney, Australia.

I emailed them about their great service and received an email back. They are so courteous and helpful and the service is top notch. Wish other dealers could live up to the same standards.

Thanks for the explanation Chris. There are so many threads on forums left up in the air and no one knows what the end result was.

[AMCQ46]

You will be the expert caliper stripper now!

So the lesson to us all is to use new parts as the old ones will have swollen and need to go in in the exact same place as they come out?

[VTRDark]

Good to hear an end result to this. Well done Chris. It must feel like you have totally new brakes now.

(:-})

[sirch345]

Thanks for explaining the resolution here Chris. Congratulations on solving the puzzle.


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Cheers Cadbury All the guys who replied here gave me a boost in enthusiasm as well as good advice, which definitely helped

Chris, glad you got it sorted. Like you (except this time) I always use new seals since they don't cost that much and the calipers are off and apart anyway.

I also ordered new rear sintered OEM brake pads and I had them delivered to my front door in 6 days. That's pretty good from UK to Sydney, Australia.

I emailed them about their great service and received an email back. They are so courteous and helpful and the service is top notch. Wish other dealers could live up to the same standards.

Thanks for the explanation Chris. There are so many threads on forums left up in the air and no one knows what the end result was.

Cheers Don I would say that is very good service good from UK to Sydney, Australia.
I'm not sure if I thought the seals were exactly cheap (perhaps I'm out of touch regarding prices). Total cost for seals were £74.95 inc. P&P (145.48 Australian dollars) (that included two seals per piston [one main seal and one dust seal) times eight pistons, equals sixteen piston seals in total, plus four caliper joining seals).
I will be emailing them about their excellent service too. You're right, David Silver's staff are very helpful and courteous, I've always found them like that when I've phoned an order through.

You will be the expert caliper stripper now!

So the lesson to us all is to use new parts as the old ones will have swollen and need to go in in the exact same place as they come out?

I never admit to being an expert about anything especially shopping in a supermarket for our weekly food We'll just say I know my way around Nissin calipers quite well now

Certainly new seals would have saved me a lot of aggro. I think you're spot on with what you're saying about the old seals Al, even if you fit the seal face back in the right way round, they could still be in a different position (I.E. 90, 180, 270 degrees or anywhere in between out). I'm sure the seals must take on a particular shape over the years.

Good to hear an end result to this. Well done Chris. It must feel like you have totally new brakes now.

(:-})

Cheers Carl Hopefully they will be good once I've fitted them

Chris.

[sirch345]

All new seals now fitted to the front calipers and bike back together. Brakes bled and all working as they should. Giving the suspended front wheel a good hard spin I can now get just over five full revolutions, result

You could definitely tell the new seals have more elasticity in them than the old ones when re-fitting the pistons, they slid in so much nicer.

Chris.

[Dr B1G]

I'm in the middle of servicing my callipers and have done a bit of research on fitting the seals the right way etc.
Chris, can you confirm the seals have to be fitted a certain way so you feel a "lip" as you pull your finger out of the caliper?

Thx
Andy

[sirch345]

I'm in the middle of servicing my callipers and have done a bit of research on fitting the seals the right way etc.
Chris, can you confirm the seals have to be fitted a certain way so you feel a "lip" as you pull your finger out of the caliper?

Thx
Andy

Hi Andy,

When I received the brand new OEM Honda caliper seals from David Silver Honda, I checked to see if I could detect any bevel on them using a 4" (100mm) engineers square, I could not detect any bevel on them.

On fitting the new caliper seals (not the dust seals, the main piston seals) I did check one seal to see if I could feel this "lip" that has been talked about on here. I could feel a "lip" with the seal fitted one way, so I turned the seal over and re-fitted it (so the face of the seal that was facing me was now facing the back of the caliper body). Guess what I could still feel a "lip" as I pulled my finger out of the caliper.

So to answer your question, no I do not see it makes any difference which way round you fit brand new OEM Honda seals.

My bike has standard OEM Firestorm calipers.

HTH's

Chris.

[Dr B1G]

Hi Chris thx very much for your reply.
I have also got new seals from David silver and calipers are currently in bits ready for fitting seals.
It's good to learn from other people's experience

Thx again
Andy