Engines back together but its loud.

[RedStormJ]

Under anything over low idle the valves are loud. It may be off timing. But I timed it so that one lobe was straight up on the rear while the other was pointed out on tdc. as per guide I believe. It also sounds a bit off while cranking like its got low compression.

My manual cct is just a bolt through the old housing pushing on the tensioner arm. I dunno if its too tight but everything rolls nice and smooth.

I really could use some help. She sounds ok but seems weak in the pants. cant ride her yet as I still have the rads off and im out of clutch fluid.

I will admit doing one part really strange and that is that I didnt use a torque wrench. instead I used a scale. I set the head bolts to 10kg and the cam bolts to 8kg. I used a conversion table as I dont have a torque wrench at this time. Tomorrow I am going to borrow one but I am pretty sure my timing is out. The lines were flat straight with the slight variation of the exhaust mark as per guide.

My manual cct is scaring me as I dont know what a good snug is considered. Its not jumpy but there is a tiny bit of slack between the gears.

The valves are hand lapped and shimmed within tolerance. I lapped them in over a good hour so I am sure its not that.

[Wicky]

Did you replace the valve guides on the bent valves?

[RedStormJ]

Was all in spec. Guides were fine. I am worried that maybe we took too much off one of the vlaves and maybe the cup is clanging around because our mic lost its zero and we took a bit more off than we wanted but a 2.00 shim was too high and 1.95 was still in tolerance of .35 clearence.

Valves that came out were terrible so I thought the guides were spent but the valves went in nice and snug. Best fit ive seen with old guides.

I am super worried about timing as she seems shy. I am afraid to zip the throttle open due to the fact that everything was torqued using a scale and the fact that my manual cct might be too tight. Id hate to lose brand new valves should the timing be out.

[tony.mon]

Under anything over low idle the valves are loud. It may be off timing. But I timed it so that one lobe was straight up on the rear while the other was pointed out on tdc. as per guide I believe. It also sounds a bit off while cranking like its got low compression.

My manual cct is just a bolt through the old housing pushing on the tensioner arm. I dunno if its too tight but everything rolls nice and smooth.

I really could use some help. She sounds ok but seems weak in the pants. cant ride her yet as I still have the rads off and im out of clutch fluid.

Forget aligning cam lobes with the horizon; instead align with reference to the head upper surface. Both cams should point at a similar angle with reference to the head upper surface- the rear should be pointing upwards and outward from the centre (spark plug line) at the same angle.
For the front head, they should be pointing upwards and outwards from each other- obviously having turned the engine over as per the guide to the correct TDC.

For tensioning with a manual tensioner:
forget the advice that they should be "finger tight".
Over the years I have played a little game with the dozens of people who have come to me for manual CCT's, by asking them ti tighten their own manual, after I've fitted them, to "finger tight". Most are about right, some to slack, some too loose.

TBH it makes little difference when you time the engine, but after starting with correct cam timing, I'd suggest that you (carefully) loosen a CCT until you can hear a slight ticking, then retighten a flat, or two max, until the ticking goes away.

This is best done with a warm engine, manuals will always rattle a bit from cold for the first two or three minutes until the metals reach normal operating temperature and the warmed items reach their optimum distances and settings from each other.
The aluminium alloy heads and crankcases/barrels will expand more than the steel cam chain, for example.

Conversely, if loosening two or three flats results in the engine speeding up, even with no screeching noise, you had them too tight. Engine tickover should remain constant throughout.

Suggest you start over with cams out on both heads, start with the rear, then rotate engine one and a quarter turns at the crankshaft anticlockwise to egt to the correct front TDC- ignore the first front TDC you see, after a quarter turn of the crankshaft.
Only install the cams when the crankshaft is in the correct position.

Lastly, what are you doing starting a water-cooled engine without coolant?
Get the timing right, then start it when it's properly assembled. Without the water jacket you'll hear all sorts of mechanical mayhem and noises. And you run the risk of overheating some parts (heads, exhaust valves) and damaging the head gaskets- and I do hope you re-thought your idea of re-using them.....

There's a bloke lives opposite that keeps firing up and running his boat engine when it's out of water. He complains regularly to me that it goes through engines...
I've tried to explain. but hey.

Good luck.

[RedStormJ]

Thanks for all that. I know you have put several posts in about this sort of thing. Ive read many of them. I was thinking the same about the jacket being empty. It didnt run for more than a few seconds at the time.

I just woke back up from last night so I am going to fix a few things,

Either my timing is correct or im 1 turn out.

First things first I want to get my torque back. Second though. I have never had trouble re using a metal gasket as I just need it to last me a week I am going to stick with it for now. If I had known that I won an auction for a spare engine I would have swapped em and tuned this one. so I am lowwww on funds. Normally I replace headbolts and gaskets. I also know its not a great idea.

If anyone would be so kind. Please post up a link to or a picture of what the rear cam should look like when the front is at proper tdc. I have read it but I amy be out one turn or dead on I am not sure wich.

[Cadbury64]

Here is a drop-box link to the VTR1000F service manual; chapter 8 is where you will find the cam installation instructions.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/wnh696qph5f11 ... F.pdf?dl=0

I manage to screw up enough things with the manual...

[RedStormJ]

Shes up and running I just need to check the cam spec. Timing was out as half expected. I also followed carls tension guide to a T

[RedStormJ]

everything is normal.

[alanfjones1411]

Seems as though you've sorted it.Well done.

[sirch345]

Glad to hear you are getting there

Chris.

[RedStormJ]

Put her up to 9,000 today after flushing all of the windshield fluid out of the radiator and giving her nice clean distilled and blue antifreeze. I mentioned at some time or another that I cant read japanese and it said -35 it was blue but I never checked the viscosity. Saw bubbles and stopped pouring.

I am out two faring bolts one gas tank isolator rubber and one of my led signals. that elbow's me out because they take some time getting here. So Ill have to run standard fronts and led rear for another month. I also got my IC flasher so I have to wire it in. Mostly Its cosmetic.

The only mechanical problems are a first gear fart at low rpm and an exhaust leak. Which I am guessing go hand in hand. I will buy leak stop tomorrow and fix the offending pipe. My clamps are rotten so I cant wait to replace the system with titanium and carbonfiber.I just need someone to weld a link pipe at the joint to make a large bore 2 into 1.

Didnt get my dymag btw but I did get a spare engine to port cam and balance. I may inject it as Its a whole spare and xl1000 parts are easy to come by I have to look into it though as the throats are too small on the 1000 which would require sp2 throats. Which may cause the need for a microsquirt which by then you might as well have used sp2 injection but at the end of the cost for power you might well have spent 1000 on good carbs.... Well see. whatevers cheap and less disturbable than the carbs on it now. I am unhappy that I have to pull the tank and that the tank isnt just dzus fasteners which is changing this spring. Then the airbox has to come off check put airbox back on check... Gets old fast. I just got it running again and the carbs are the first thing to annoy me. Otherwise it brings a smile.

Which brings me to this... What face do I make when I ride my bike what face do you make. I dont think I smile but it feels good when I am finished. Kind of like sex. you just feel good after. you smile after.