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craigybaby · Post by **craigybaby** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 11:35 pm

Hey

A few weeks ago I plagued you all about my bike vibrating.

Well at the moment my bike is going back and forth to the workshop.

They seem to think that there is nothing wrong with it and I disagree. I know that the V twin "pulses" under the power strokes but the vibrations on the bike are so bad at the moment that I can only do about 20 min blasts before my hands and feet are numb.

The entire bike vibrates... bars, frame, footpegs, fairing - everything.
It vibrates in or out of gear and for the entire rev range.

Some peeps have said that teh VTR is naturally vibey, I was just canvassing for some feeback on this comment. Are all your bikes this vibey?

I think the garage are wrong because I don't remember the bike being that harsh when I took it out on a test ride.

I've given the bike to another VTR rider who says that its not right - its ruff as chuff and that there's a strong smell of unburnt fuel.

Any ideas? I'm losing the will to live with it!!

delta1 · Post by **delta1** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 11:50 pm

have you tried getting the carbs balanced? have heard that bad vibes are a sympton of that, cant promise this will help just what ive heard.

Big Stu · Post by **Big Stu** » Thu Aug 03, 2006 11:51 pm

Sorry i cant be much help, but mine is exactly the same including the smell of unburnt petrol, i have booked it in at the dealers (ESB at bolton ) for a service and to check and balance the carbs. if anything shows up, i will post a reply.

Stu

craigybaby · Post by **craigybaby** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:11 am

have had plugs changed and carbs balanced

its got just over 11k on the clock.

one theory i've had put forward is this.....

it seems its a little bit down on power (coming from another vtr rider). the strong smell of unburnt fuel would indicated that it's not firing properly. the cause of the vibration could be due to a valve not seating properly causing a misfire causing the vibration.

I've ruled out all the simple stuff - engine mounting bolts, plugs, carbs. i don't know what else it could de.

the dealer is fobbing me off but I know the VTR shouldn't run like this.

Does anyone else have vibration this bad that they can only ride it for about 20/30 mins before their hands and feet are numb. The vibes come right thru the bike - seat, pegs, bars everywhere. Like I've protested time and time again to the dealer, it hasn't always run like that.

MrMastodon · Post by **MrMastodon** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:23 am

yeah - as you noted in my 'hello' post, mine is a shakey old thing too. Still at the 'is this normal?' phase!

I was thinking of getting some vacuum gauges and balancing carbs - but if it didn't help you, I might not bother.

Very intersted in any more news on this though.

craigybaby · Post by **craigybaby** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 12:33 am

hey mate

how would you describe the vibes in your bike

any particular rev? in gear? in neutral?
do you feel it in the bars or pegs?

It would be worth you getting the carbs balanced anyway so that you can eliminate that.

Zer0Zer0 · Post by **Zer0Zer0** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 8:49 am

I would say you guys are correct...I never get as much as a tingle..even after an all day ride..my Zed 750 ..on the other hand vibrated like hell,
numb fingers etc...something is definatly not right .with your VTR..
as to what tho..?????
sorry.

Stratman · Post by **Stratman** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 5:55 pm

Mine only vibrated badly after the CCT had gone and the "repair" hadn't been done properly. Now it doesn't vibrate (any more than a twin would/should) so you do have a problem somewhere and valves/valve timing sounds like a candidate.

tractorbiker · Post by **tractorbiker** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 6:14 pm

just to echo what stratman and zerozero say...I can ride the storm for as long the gas lasts with no effect. I remember reading somewhere how the Storm is "more of a lumpy VFR than a japanese 916", and I would say the comparison to the VFR is pretty close...when they're running right..!

Pete.L · Post by **Pete.L** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 8:37 pm

craigybaby wrote:Hey

A few weeks ago I plagued you all about my bike vibrating.

Well at the moment my bike is going back and forth to the workshop.

They seem to think that there is nothing wrong with it and I disagree. I know that the V twin "pulses" under the power strokes but the vibrations on the bike are so bad at the moment that I can only do about 20 min blasts before my hands and feet are numb.

The entire bike vibrates... bars, frame, footpegs, fairing - everything.
It vibrates in or out of gear and for the entire rev range.

Some peeps have said that teh VTR is naturally vibey, I was just canvassing for some feeback on this comment. Are all your bikes this vibey?

I think the garage are wrong because I don't remember the bike being that harsh when I took it out on a test ride.

I've given the bike to another VTR rider who says that its not right - its ruff as chuff and that there's a strong smell of unburnt fuel.

Any ideas? I'm losing the will to live with it!!

Deos it have the orignal jets and needles in it?
Bad Dyno jetting can cause this

Pete.l

delmeekc · Post by **delmeekc** » Fri Aug 04, 2006 9:50 pm

If the dealer says they have balanced the carbs check to see if the front blanking cap head screw looks like it has been removed, if not then there is no way they have balanced the carbs. The cylinders are made from the same cast and just machined different so locate the rear first and then look at the diagonally opposite position on the front cylinder. The rear will have a brass spigot and a black rubber hose fitted instead of the cap head and is on the foward facing side of the rear cylinder just to the lower left of the inlet rubber (this provides the vac for the fuel tap). The front cap head is on the right side of the inlet rubber on the front cylinder. It will be a small 3/4mm allen head with an alloy washer.

craigybaby · Post by **craigybaby** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:22 am

Ta for the info.

I think it is defo something to do with the valves/valve timing.

It defo isn't right - you can hear it running rough/misfiring if you hold the throttle at a steady rpm.

I've been advised to do the following before venturing in taking bits of the engine apart.

1. Krypton tuning - not actually for the tuning but to measure the emissions. block one exhaust off and measure the emissions through the other one. Apparently if there is unburnt fuel coming out then the hydrocarbon reading will be sky high. (sounds very technical but apparently this will confirm a misfire.)

2. Compression test. If the emissions test confirms high levels of HCBs, then a compression test will determine if the misfire is mechanical (piston, valves etc) or electrical (what ever else makes it spark

)

Sounds good and not too expensive.

The dealer have washed their hands of this time and time again. As i have said, I know that the VTR is a V Twin and pulsates during power strokes but this is an abnormal vibration.

The bike has been into the garage 4 times under warranty - each time I've asked them to do a compression test and each time they haven't. Now as far as I can tell, it's free to do a compression test - you just connect the machine up to the cylinder and crank it over.

I reckon something is amiss (pardon the pun!)

craigybaby · Post by **craigybaby** » Sun Aug 06, 2006 12:26 am

Just out of curiosity....

Whats a throttle position sensor?

Do you reckon that it could be something worth checking? I seem to recall from reading here that it has something to do with timing - any reason to suspect that this could cause a vibration?

How do i check if its working properly?

Pete.L · Post by **Pete.L** » Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:58 pm

Craig,
It would pull like poo if it was faulty.
Very slow pick up to about six grand and then it would pick up properly.
It can be easily checked by pulling the plug of the end of the sensor with the ignition switched off and putting an meter across the terminals. If you see a change in resistance when you turn the throttle it's working or if you want to be more accurate you can put the plug back on, turn the ignition on and check for a change in voltage back at the ECU.
i can't remember the exact pins or voltages off the top of my head but if you feel you need them give me a shout and I'll look them up for you.

Pete.l

MrMastodon · Post by **MrMastodon** » Mon Aug 07, 2006 10:06 pm

Pete.L wrote:Craig,
If you see a change in resistance when you turn the throttle it's working or if you want to be more accurate you can put the plug back on, turn the ignition on and check for a change in voltage back at the ECU.
i can't remember the exact pins or voltages off the top of my head but if you feel you need them give me a shout and I'll look them up for you.

Pete.l

Had a quick look at the workshop manual and as a "Operation Inspection", it says to disconnect the connector from the sensor (rhs of engine, looking past frame), start the engine and rev the engine to 3500rpm or above. With these constant revs, plug the connector back in and the engine speed should increase.

Further, as Pete.l says, you can check voltages/resistances for a more thorough check:

Disconnect the ICM (Ignition Control Module) (black box under back of seat with big connector). Measure betweem the green/black and yellow/black wires on the connector. Standard is 4 to 6K.

Check the resistance between the red/yellow and green black changes with throttle position.

With the ignition on the voltage between the yellow/black (+) and green/black (-) is between 4.7V and 5.3V.

It then goes on to the replacement, where at the end of the section it states that the resistance beween terminals A and B (top and rhs looking at the sensor with the connector unplugged) should be set to 490 to 510ohms. I found it easier to plug the sensor in, unplug the ICM and measure there (follow wire colours).

Hope this helps. I don't think it'll sort the vibration, but I'd be really interested in what you think having done it.

VTR1000.ORG

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