CCT Failure

[Troutman]

I've done "copy image address" and pasted that into "URL" ...there's now more numbers and stuff...does that help?

[hallie]

[tony.mon]

Most definitely a failed spring.

As said, the front cam cover has to come off. You can just about see the marks with the fairing still on, by removing the airbox, carbs and plastic heat shield, but it's a lot easier with the fairing off- which is just a ten minute job.
Five with practice.

The difficult bit is to lower the oil cooler- you have to undo the bracket to frame screws, not just the bracket to cooler screws, and brush/blow all the dirt away form that area before undoing the cam cover. Otherwise all the dirt and road grit drops in the engine while you're working on it....
Lay a rag on the rear pf the front mudguard, remove the two brackets which locate the lower points of the two radiators and work the cooler down out of the way, to rest on the rag.
Then you can pull the cam cover off and check propelry.

What worries me is that you have turned the engine over and heard clicking noises- that's almost certainly the front cams "sticking" in position while the chain climbs over the sprocket teeth, and the timing will now be out for sure.
If you just refit a tensioner there is a very real risk of piston hitting valve straight away..

So you have no alternative but to retime the front head properly.

[Troutman]

The fairing is off so I just need to lower the oil cooler..thanks for the help there.
The noise I heard was more of a rattle..like a chain rubbing on some casting that it shouldn't be, fairly sure it wasn't the chain climbing over the cam sprockets. I hope so anyway.
I'll have a go tonight and see what I find in there.

[Troutman]

OK so it was the chain climbing over the sprocket, cam cover off and I could see and hear it as I turned the crank anti-clockwise...bummer.
So I need to reset the timing on the front. Forum search!
I suppose when I said the engine was still running when this happened it might have just been on one cylinder..could that be right? I wasn't really listening to it just trying to find a safe place to pull off the road., I was only going about 15mph.
The only way the head might be saved is if this happened on a compression stroke for the front..correct? Me turning it with a 1/2" socket isn't going to bend the valves is it?

[tony.mon]

A cct failure can only happen on one cylinder. It would be a bizarre coincidence that they went at the same time.

So remove the cams from the affected cylinder, and loop the chain round a screwdriver in the cam cutouts. Start from the good cylinder and time that first, with the correct TDC mark located in the viewing window. Then install the tensioner for that cylinder.

You can then rotate the engine the correct number of turns until the other cylinder's mark lines up. NOTE it may not be correct the first time you see the mark, you might have to go round until it appears a second time- count those degrees.....

Then you can install the missing cams in the correct place.

It is best to have a helper lightly pull the loose cam chain up with their fingers to stop it snagging on the cranks sprocket as you turn the engine.

When you have done this, install the second tensioner, then you are ready to check the valve clearances on the affected one. If they're looser than specified, then you have bent valves and need to pull the head off.

[Troutman]

Ok thanks for the info tony.mon
The rear is fine, it's timed and the old tensioner is still in there but in full working order.
So the removing the cams is the best/only way to get them lined up with the top of the head?

[Troutman]

Taken the cams out, turned crank to line up with FT mark, put cams back in as they should go, facing out and FE/FI marks in line with top of head.
Now to do a valve check.

[Troutman]

A cct failure can only happen on one cylinder. It would be a bizarre coincidence that they went at the same time.

Tony..what I meant in my post was, could the engine have been running on one cylinder or would it be jumping all over the place, I seem to remember it running ok and responded to an input of very slight throttle to keep it moving so I could get to a farm entrance. Dear god how do you check them valve clearances?? ET's fingers again!!

[sirch345]

It sounds like you are doing a good job there, fingers crossed the valves are okay,

Chris.

[Troutman]

Done a valve clearance check and they appear to be spot on! Does this mean it's likely the valves are OK? I was thinking maybe I should get a compression tester and check that way too before I put it all back together.

[sirch345]

Done a valve clearance check and they appear to be spot on! Does this mean it's likely the valves are OK? I was thinking maybe I should get a compression tester and check that way too before I put it all back together.

Yes it does mean the valves are likely to be okay, but as you say, a compression test would be a good idea while you're there just to be sure,

Chris.

[Troutman]

New CCT's arrived with no new gasket! , I can't find any info on how to put these in , do you just bolt them in and take the wee tool out and put the old bolt and washer back in? They do have the black rubber lump on the end, I thought you were supposed to take that off the old ones.

[Wicky]

There should be a metal cap on the end of the old OEM CCT - check it's not stuck in the hole if it didn't come out with the original CCT. Instead of a gasket (seperate part no.) you can use instant silicone gasket. Or simply order a pair from Honda.

Instructions for installing are in the workshop knowledgebase as well as measurements for making the special 'key'.

[tony.mon]

Silicon sealer is perfectly ok, instead of a gasket. A gasket adds nothing; I've never known a cct to leak from the gasket face. The rear one will weep on a manual one if sealer isn't applied to the thread prior to fitting, as it points down and oil will leak downwards due to gravity.