juddering clutch

[fabiostar]

when you have the clutch apart just check there isnt to much play in the basket. as in the large needle bearing the clutch runs on.

[Red3446]

when you have the clutch apart just check there isnt to much play in the basket. as in the large needle bearing the clutch runs on.

Consider one thing: after the problem occurred I took a new complete clutch from a brand new engine and the problem remained.
Anyway, today I'll remove the whole clutch set and I'll control everything one more time: discs, spring drives, bearings, basket, hub......something is working bad, and I must found it!!

[jchesshyre]

If the problem is exactly the same after swapping the whole clutch then before you take it apart again I would definitely thoroughly check out the clutch master cylinder (including the lever assembly, pushrod and bush) and slave cylinder, and the main clutch pushrod (is it bent and is it installed the right way round?). It could be that some aspect of one of these things is stopping the clutch fully engaging.

[Red3446]

If the problem is exactly the same after swapping the whole clutch then before you take it apart again I would definitely thoroughly check out the clutch master cylinder (including the lever assembly, pushrod and bush) and slave cylinder, and the main clutch pushrod (is it bent and is it installed the right way round?). It could be that some aspect of one of these things is stopping the clutch fully engaging.

All operation included in the next step investigation, included a complete slave cylinder rebuilt!

[Red3446]

SO, HERE WE GO!

Cover and clutch are off









.....oooops, something is missing, here....



and everything necessary, new actuator's piston included. Next purchase master cilynder revision kit and pushrod.



Sincerly.....as previously everything seems in good condition. The only "unusual" thing: I've found all discs strangely dry of oil after only one day of stop....compared to other times I removed the clutch...

[tony.mon]

The sprocket cover on the other side should have a spacer fitted between the cover and the crankcase, I think.
With that missing the cover will be too close to the engine and that will have the effect of making the clutch pushrod seem too long.

That applies to the SP series, can't remember if it also applies to storms.
You can check on the parts diagrams.

[jchesshyre]

The sprocket cover on the other side should have a spacer fitted between the cover and the crankcase, I think.
With that missing the cover will be too close to the engine and that will have the effect of making the clutch pushrod seem too long.

That applies to the SP series, can't remember if it also applies to storms.
You can check on the parts diagrams.

Good call, it should indeed have a spacer, or as Honda call it, 'plate, drive chain guide'.
https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/51 ... left-cover

[tony.mon]

The sprocket cover on the other side should have a spacer fitted between the cover and the crankcase, I think.
With that missing the cover will be too close to the engine and that will have the effect of making the clutch pushrod seem too long.

That applies to the SP series, can't remember if it also applies to storms.
You can check on the parts diagrams.

Good call, it should indeed have a spacer, or as Honda call it, 'plate, drive chain guide'.
https://www.fowlersparts.co.uk/parts/51 ... left-cover

Yeah, I really should get a life...

[Red3446]

Yes, the spacer is ok!

I've measured all steel discs and ther's something wrong on two of them: a not perfect machining (i didn't pointed out.....my mistake). As those discs cames from a new engine used for training in the past, I can suppose someone made something not really correct.....I decided to replace all steel discs to be sure.

Previous original discs was not really ok in wear so I decided to install those other new discs, sure that they were ok....but there's something's wrong also on those and I didn't pointed out....

In other words......I'm a jackass!

[jchesshyre]

Yet you replaced the whole clutch and it was doing the same before you did so?

[Red3446]

Yet you replaced the whole clutch and it was doing the same before you did so?

Yes. I was unlucky, but also not scrupulous. I was sure that new discs were ok as they were new....but I was wrong.

[Red3446]

To explain better:

Those are original discs, with evident not uniform wear due to deformation:



Those are discs from the new clutch I've on since now: not regular machining is evident but I thought (wrongly) it was normal machining.....

[jchesshyre]

Sincerly.....as previously everything seems in good condition. The only "unusual" thing: I've found all discs strangely dry of oil after only one day of stop....compared to other times I removed the clutch...

Not wanting to worry the OP, but does anyone else think there could be a chance that he has an issue with the oil feed to his clutch? This could explain the bad operation of the clutch, the wear marks on both sets of plain plates, and the plates being dry of oil (which definitely doesn't seem right to me).

[Red3446]

Sincerly.....as previously everything seems in good condition. The only "unusual" thing: I've found all discs strangely dry of oil after only one day of stop....compared to other times I removed the clutch...

Not wanting to worry the OP, but does anyone else think there could be a chance that he has an issue with the oil feed to his clutch? This could explain the bad operation of the clutch, the wear marks on both sets of plain plates, and the plates being dry of oil (which definitely doesn't seem right to me).

Sincerly.....in previous times I remove the clutch set I did it after few hours from turning off the engine, this time after a day, so I really don't know if the few oil I found on discs is ok or not.
Looking at the oil flow chart it seems that the oil into the primary shaft stops against the clutch joint and previously it lubricates the clutch basket's bearing....so I don't think it goes into the clutch assy internally (or, at least, only a verly little quantity of it). Only splashed oil lubricates the clutch.

[Red3446]

New steel discs arrived, and the difference with other two ones is clear.....