Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

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budd
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Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by budd »

OK, I know this is an M/C but I'm sure there's some domestic electricians out there who could advise me on this problem I have. Moderators if this post is deemed inappropriate please remove it, although personally I can't see a problem pooling knowledge whether it's motorcycle related or not.

Just after Xmas I fitted a new shower after our previous one failed, I bought a Creda shower and replaced the old one, at first all was well but then my wife noticed a burning smell, (prefer soaking my grease and chain lube off in the bath so I didn't notice it myself) over the next few weeks the smell continued, eventually I took a look at it, and I was quite shocked at what I found see pics below
firstly a overview of the shower unit to show where the damage is located within it.

Image

secondly a close up of the damaged melted wire

Image

As you can see from the above pics the neg wire as melted, now i'm assuming that this is because the electrical feed wires are of an inadequate size/rating to the shower unit, I'm go to have to replace the power feed cable regardless and I'm pretty sure this was the problem, but i'm not an electrician and it's only an assumption based on my knowledge that cable rating needs to be appropriate to the load, but is there anything else that would cause the wiring to melt in this way (particularly noting it was the only the neg wire effected), faulty unit ?
Any advise would be most welcome, cheers
I've now gone all European and bought a KTM Superduke GT and Aprilia RSV1000R :D ,
Storm is now gone :cry: .
.
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benny hedges
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Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by benny hedges »

Most showers now are 7-11kw and will need at least a 10mm wire section.
Thats not 10mm diameter btw lol.
And yes, its nearly always the neg that burns out.
You need to undo the wire at the consumer unit and twist the new, bigger cable on the end, then get up in the loft and pull the new cable through.
Dont forget to buy more wire than you think you need, and also uprate the breaker to a c40 mcb :)

You also need to check all the wires are good and tight as loose connections are the most common cause of burnt wires.... And house fires!!!
You do not have to say anything. But it may harm your defence if you do not mention when posting something which you later rely on in quote. Anything you do say may be ripped to sh*t.
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budd
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Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by budd »

benny hedges wrote:Most showers now are 7-11kw and will need at least a 10mm wire section.
Thats not 10mm diameter btw lol.
And yes, its nearly always the neg that burns out.
You need to undo the wire at the consumer unit and twist the new, bigger cable on the end, then get up in the loft and pull the new cable through.
Dont forget to buy more wire than you think you need, and also uprate the breaker to a c40 mcb :)

You also need to check all the wires are good and tight as loose connections are the most common cause of burnt wires.... And house fires!!!
cheers for that, the shower is 9.5Kw I didn't fit the original shower and simply replaced it with a new one when the old one failed, assuming it had been fine previously so there was no need to change anything, it seems though that showers have got increasingly more powerful over the years and I didn't buy the cheapest available which I'd guess are of a lower rating.

The old shower is linked to a 40a isolator roof switch, (the type with the string and red light) which in turn links it to the fuse box , does this need replacing to are will it be OK just to run the uprated cable from the roof switch?
I've now gone all European and bought a KTM Superduke GT and Aprilia RSV1000R :D ,
Storm is now gone :cry: .
.
marty b
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Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2011 5:39 pm

Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by marty b »

hi budd your gona need to run a 30 amp cable to the pull switch which should be double poled and then back to the consumer unit
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budd
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Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by budd »

marty b wrote:hi budd your gona need to run a 30 amp cable to the pull switch which should be double poled and then back to the consumer unit
cheers I'll have a look at the cable between the consumer and the pull switch see what's fitted there, the house was built in in 1972 so I'd guess the regs have changed quite a bit since then.
I've now gone all European and bought a KTM Superduke GT and Aprilia RSV1000R :D ,
Storm is now gone :cry: .
.
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toonarmy
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Location: south shields

Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by toonarmy »

hello mate you need to run a 10mm twin and earth cable in one piece from the consumer unit with a 40amp mcb which should be rcd protected to the isolater switch then to the shower 9.5 kw you may get away with a 32 amp mcb and 6mm twin and earth but if you ever upgrade the shower again and go highter than 9.5 kw you will have trouble again im part p and 17th edition for my sins lol :thumbup:
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benny hedges
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Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by benny hedges »

toonarmy wrote:hello mate you need to run a 10mm twin and earth cable in one piece from the consumer unit with a 40amp mcb which should be rcd protected to the isolater switch then to the shower :thumbup:
this is correct.
dont just change the wire to the ceiling switch or the cable will just burn back further where you cant see it or smell it....
as i said earlier, this is how fires start.

i wouldnt bother with the 6mm. theres next to no difference in price per metre so get the 10mm.
i prefer stranded singles / multicore than twin & earth cos the cheapo choccy block connectors dont grip the single solid copper conductors very well - and they do come loose when they get warm.

if you are not 100% confident in what you are doing, then ask around and get a qualified person to do it for you.
i suggest you also have them look at the consumer unit as well cos i'll bet it's an old bakelite one with fuse wire fuses lol...

a good new domestic consumer unit complete with mcb's and 100A incomer will set you back about £80.

ir also qualified to do this but tbh my cable pulling days are over lol.... mostly panel work & faultfinding i do now, leave all the monkey work to the young uns lol! :Beer Popcorn:
You do not have to say anything. But it may harm your defence if you do not mention when posting something which you later rely on in quote. Anything you do say may be ripped to sh*t.
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budd
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Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by budd »

yeah plan is to use 10mm cable from isolator to shower, but first I'm going to make sure the feed from the fuse box is up to it I'm hoping this is already 10mm and your quite right benny thie fuse box is a old style bakerlite thing which should have been replaced years ago, but I've a long list of things that need doing so one thing at a time :thumbup:
I've now gone all European and bought a KTM Superduke GT and Aprilia RSV1000R :D ,
Storm is now gone :cry: .
.
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toonarmy
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Location: south shields

Re: Domestic electrical problem (not bike)

Post by toonarmy »

best get a stand alone 40 amp rcd and split your tails mate just to make shower extra safe not an expensive job but priceless safety wise
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