EBC Organic Rear Brake Pad, VTR Shim Question.

[TheGingerBeardMan]

.
I'm about to fit a new set of rear brake pads.

I have bought another set of EBC FA174 (Organic) pads, as I favour them over the sintered ones. (all my bikes get organic pads)

BUT,

I have noticed a NEW STICKER on the brake pad packet stating:

"NOTE: PLEASE DO NOT REFIT O/E SHIM+ INSULATOR ON ORGANIC PAD"

This sticker has never been there on any set I've used previously, and on the Firestorm, I've fitted new pads WITH the blue shim/insulator, and had no problems.

So, can anyone say if I should adhere to the EBC packing advice, and NOT include the blue VTR pad spacer when I fit these new pads?

If I don't include the spacer this time, what will happen? Will heat warp my caliper or something daft like heat drying out the seals? The spacer/insulator is there (to me) for a reason.

Thanks in advance for the replies.

[MacV2]

Maybe it's just a space issue, i.e. the Organic pads are thicker so with the spacer they will be touching the disc all the time when new...

I'd have thought the best people to ask is EBC, they must have a reason...

[TheGingerBeardMan]

the best people to ask is EBC, they must have a reason...

Thanks for the suggestion. I shall give them a call to see why the change. I suppose I better phone Honda UK Tech Dept and ask there too, just to get their feedback. Just thought one of you guys may have had the same "warning". But, as yer all knee down and balls out, you'll all be on sintered pads.

Thanks Mr V2.

[budd]

Is there an adhesive backing on the pad? I know Mintex supply what is essentially a double sided self adhesive pad to stick on the back of new pads (at least they do for Race/Rally pads) with this pad in place you can't get the anti squeal shims in even if you wanted to, My advice would be test fit the pads and check clearances, although I'm interested to hear EBCs response to your query (and indeed Honda's)
Either way there's no safety issue whether you fit the shims or not, some bikes have shims other don't, The Honda Nissin brakes do but my current bike with Brembo calipers (RSV) doesn't, which is probably a good thing because it as 8 pads in the front calipers fitting 8 little shims would be a proper pain.

[TheGingerBeardMan]

OK.

The reply from Honda UK Technical and the local Honda bike dealer.

Both concur the same thing for the blue plastic plate and thin metal trim that clips over the rear pads in the caliper.

The shim or plate serves both as an "anti-rattle" and the plastic bit acts as a heat dispersant aid to save "cooking the seals" in the caliper.

Although the plate/shim is wafer thin, it apparently does absorb some of the transferred heat away from the piston seals.

Both recommended leaving the brakes as per Honda factory. That is, ignoring EBC, and to retain the plates.

Which, is what I'll do: leave em fitted, sandwiching both with Coppa-Slip (like I've always done, and had no problems stopping in the past).

I didn't get a reply from EBC, as their technical boffins were not available, but they took my number to call me back.

But, there's obviously a reason for EBC to now put a warning sticker on their new packing, and I'm still curious as to why. Oh well. If they phone, they phone. If not, I'll not lose any sleep over it.

[sirch345]

That's the first time I've heard that, interesting

Chris.

[bazzashadow]

would of been nice to hear from ebc because the stickers would of cost them money to print so they would not be wasting money for nothing

[VTRDark]

Interesting info there GBM and I too am a bit disappointed that EBC have not replied. Shame on them.

(:-})

[sirch345]

I didn't get a reply from EBC, as their technical boffins were not available, but they took my number to call me back.

May be they will get back to you next week,

Chris.

[TheGingerBeardMan]

Yup, it was a bit disappointing that they didn't call back. If they don't call me by 12pm on Monday (30th June), then I'll keep trying them. I've decided I want an answer now!

[TheGingerBeardMan]

just a short update (yeah, I know...amazing feat for me).

A whole week passed, and despite phoning EBC on Monday, and Tuesday....and Wednesday, I STILL haven't got an answer. The woman just says "yes, we have your details, and will get the technical dept top call you back when they are available".

NOT GOOD ENOUGH EBC. Get yer finger out, or I'm sending the brake pads down in a thousand bits saying to go **** yerself sideways and I'm never buying your stuff again. There's plenty other brand pads out there I can choose.

Not that I've said that....but I'm really close to it.

No replies to de post required. If I get an answer, I'll update again.

[VTRDark]

Maybe they have a wee problem with understanding your accent.

(:-})

[TheGingerBeardMan]

Maybe they have a wee problem with understanding your accent.

Fit dae ye mean min? I dinnae hae ony problim wi it, y'ken?

[roger64]

I fitted EBC double-h sintered pads all round the other week and that was on my rear pads as well (NOTE please do not refit O/E shim+insulater) I just thought it was to aid with heat transfer well I better stop thinking it doesn't do me any good.

[TheGingerBeardMan]

I just thought it was to aid with heat transfer

Well, that's what Honda UK said they were there for (the plasticky "shim" that sits under the metal clip plate).

They advised me to ignore EBC and to fit the brake pads WITH the shim/insulator, as the plastic/asbestos looking plate helps to absorb some of the heat, to save the caliper seals. But there's a shim on the other side, where there is no seal or piston? I dunno. I compared the NEW EBC brake thickness with a set in the shop that doesn't have the new advisory sticker, and there is no difference in pad thickness.

Oh well. As "Toyah" once sang: "It's a mythtery". (Yeah, I know, I'm cruel. But as she has a lisp, that's what it sounds like in the song)